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Telephone Taped Conversations
The Cobain case telephone taped audio files were first released to the public in December of
2001. They include tape recorded conversations with persons intimately involved in the
Amazingly, e-mailed letters to the Grant Company regarding the Cobain Case continue to
increase in volume, month after month, year after year. Interest continues to grow as more and more Nirvana fans around the world are gaining access to computers and logging onto the Internet.
This investigation might be old news to many, but thousands of Nirvana fans, both young and old, are just now learning the truth about the suspicious circumstances surrounding Kurt Cobain's untimely death. Nirvana fans continue to e-mail daily, urging that we "keep going and never give up."
If you're new to the investigation, you might want to study the case first, in order to
understand the relevance of the recorded excerpts. These are only a fraction of more
than 30 hours of recorded conversations from our Cobain Case files. At the proper time,
more excerpts may be released if we deem it necessary.
Placing audio files on the website requires significant memory and available server space, so the cuts placed here are very specific and relatively short. Most excerpts from the original tapes are longer.
As you listen to the cuts posted on this page, it will be important to be aware of the
time factor as explained below.
Before and After
All "BEF" files come from interviews and conversations which occurred during the
week prior to April 8th, BEFORE anyone allegedly knew Kurt Cobain was dead.
All "AFT" files come from interviews and conversations which occurred AFTER
Kurt's body was discovered on April 8th.
The file numbers of these excerpts are only useful for labeling and reference.
Other than the "BEF" (before) and "AFT" (after) codes, the numbers will have
little significance to the listener. The numbers and codes do not necessarily
relate to the time or exact date of the conversation. For examination and investigation
purposes, the files have been catalogued by event and topic, not by time of, or exact date of
occurrence (other than before and after Cobain's death).
I want to make something very clear at this point. The excerpts I'm releasing here do not alone prove that Kurt Cobain was murdered. They will prove, however, that there was considerable suspicious activity, including lies and misinformation being fed to the press, before and after Kurt Cobain was found dead. They will also help substantiate facts and details that I've revealed over the years about the events surrounding Cobain's death.
When someone turns up missing, and those who are close to the missing person begin
telling false stories and lying about the details and events leading up to the
disappearance, any investigator with half a brain should become somewhat suspicious.
As Ben Klugman and I walked down the hallway and out of the Peninsula
Hotel after our first meeting with Courtney Love, we were baffled and confused by her
manipulative attitude towards her missing husband. Also, her obsession with her career and much of the information she had just given us didn't make much sense.
I turned to Ben and said, "This doesn't smell right. We're going to tape all calls.
I want everything we do here to be well documented."
Excerpts from conversations recorded
it was known that Cobain was dead
Courtney tells me she used Det. Terry to get a drug dealer busted. The fact that
Courtney often bought her own drugs from this same dealer is a side issue. What's
important to note here is that Courtney had a personal friendship with this narcotics
detective. She called him once on my car phone while she was with me. Detective
Terry was even mentioned in Kurt's Missing Person report as someone to see for
Detective Terry was murdered shortly after Kurt Cobain was found dead.
Courtney says Kurt "has no friends."
And. . . "I always see on TV where the woman comes in and she's like. . . 'There's
no way he could have killed himself.'"
This was taped BEFORE the public was even aware that Kurt was missing and several
days before anyone supposedly knew he was dead. The comment could have been another slip of the tongue by Courtney or it could be explained away in a number of ways
that might make sense. I just found it interesting.
Some journalists have written that Kurt was afraid Courtney might leave him if he
didn't go into rehab and kick his heroin addiction. The truth is, just prior to his
death, Kurt was actually trying to leave Courtney!
After Cobain's death, when rumors of a pending divorce began to surface, Courtney
denied she and Kurt were having marital problems and said there was never any talk
This is a discussion we had about the note from the Rome incident. Remember, the
Rome incident was called an "accident" while Kurt was still alive. After his death,
when he wasn't around to set the record straight, the Rome incident was suddenly
called a "suicide attempt."
So, what did Kurt tell Courtney about the incident in Rome and the note he left? In
this conversation recorded on April 3rd, 1994, BEFORE Cobain was found dead, she
tells me, "He claims he was leaving me." (Note the present tense - "claims").
It's a long file so this is just a short portion of the conversation. When you listen
to more of the conversation on the Cobain Case Audio Tape, it sounds amazingly similar
to the interview Courtney did for the December 1994 issue of Rolling Stone Magazine
where she told David Fricke about "another note" she supposedly found in her bedroom
after Kurt's body was discovered in Seattle. But here she's telling me about the Rome note. . . in almost identical terms!
Courtney seems to have a problem keeping her lies straight.
From the time Kurt left the rehab center in Marina Del Rey and went missing, journalists
were being fed stories by Courtney and her friends. On several occasions, Courtney even
tried to get me to plant stories for her.
The press was portraying Courtney during this period of time as "desperate," "frantic,"
"afraid," etc. "She knew he was going to die!" they wrote obligingly as she pulled the
strings of eager but gullible journalists.
But the woman I was dealing with seemed to be an unbelievable opportunist, obsessed
more with promoting her own career than actually finding her "suicidal" husband.
These are excerpts from a conversation I had with Courtney on April 3, 1994. She's
telling me about the phony story she had planted with the Associated Press the night
before. She's also asking my advice on how she might "expand" her lie and take advantage of the additional publicity it will inevitably bring. Listen carefully to the comments listed below.
Courtney pulled the same stunt a few days later, on Thursday night, the night she had
expected Kurt's body to be discovered by Carlson and I. The press reported she overdosed in her Peninsula Hotel room and that it might have been a "suicide attempt."
I eventually became convinced that these phony overdose events were actually an attempt by Courtney to make Kurt's "pending" death appear to be a "suicide pact" and that she somehow survived.
(Later, after Cobain's body was found, but while I was still in Seattle, I heard Paul
Harvey report the "suicide pact" rumor on one of his radio vignettes).
One of Courtney's favorite publicity tactics during this period of time was to attract
sympathy from the press and, most importantly, from Kurt's adoring fans. This would
help make the transition from "Nirvana fan" to "Hole fan" seem completely natural.
BEF-171a "All publicity is good publicity"
BEF-171b "What should I tell the AP?"
"If it goes in and I deny it... people will believe me..."
BEF-171d "The sympathy goes to me"
"How's that for a spin. . ."
"It's gonna appear that I attempted suicide."
"It might even help sell records!"
You'll hear me laugh slightly when she makes this comment. This was one of the first
of many conversations we had. It was too soon for me to fully understand what was
really going on.
Later, when I reviewed this conversation on tape, things became a little more clear.
Her husband was missing. . .
She was telling everyone he was suicidal. . .
and she just KNOWS he's going to die!
But hey, she's got records to sell!
"I won't tell him I was never in the hospital."
"The people I had do this, (plant the phony story), I paid."
Excerpts from conversations recorded
it was known that Cobain was dead
As mentioned in the Cobain Case Study Manual, after Cobain's death, Courtney's very
own entertainment attorney, Rosemary Carroll, told me, "Kurt wasn't suicidal, Tom."
Rosemary was also close to Kurt and she was suspicious that Courtney had something to do with Kurt's death.
This is Rosemary Carroll asking me to, "Come over again. There's some stuff I want to
Rosemary was disturbed by the handwriting on the so-called "suicide note" from Seattle.
She wanted me to look at samples of Courtney's handwriting.
Rosemary Carroll agreeing that Cali's letter sounded phony.
Rosemary Carroll thought Cali wrote the phony letter because he, (Cali), "KNEW
that Kurt was dead!"
Dylan Carlson and I stopped at a pay phone while we were in Seattle searching for
Kurt. Dylan called Courtney, (who was staying at Rosemary's house in Los Angeles),
to get further instructions. Rosemary later told me she was standing next to
Courtney when Courtney was on the phone with Dylan and heard her say to him, "Be
sure to check the greenhouse."
Dylan later denied Courtney had told him to check the greenhouse.
Rosemary tells me here, "It's obvious they're lying."
Rosemary comments on Courtney's ability to manipulate the police and the press.
"It's amazing that she can do this... ya know!"
What would you do if someone you knew appeared on a nationally syndicated radio talk
show and implicated you, by name, in a murder plot against your very own husband
And what if you were completely innocent, had no knowledge of any murder plot and had
nothing at all to do with it?
And what if you were a famous, wealthy, influential and powerful person with a hair
trigger temper and a reputation for blasting everyone who might dare to even
What would you say to that jerk, that idiot who "falsely"
accused you of such a horrendous crime?!
January 19, 1995
After listening to a recording of a radio broadcast in which I accused her of
conspiracy in the murder of her husband, Courtney Love called me from New Zealand.
The remaining excerpts are taken from this conversation. It lasted nearly an hour.
As you listen, ask yourself what Courtney is afraid of here? I'm not a police officer
anymore. I'm a private investigator. I have no governmental or legal authority in
this case. Courtney doesn't have to talk to me or answer ANY of my questions.
Shouldn't she just she tell me what a stupid #@%&*# I am?!
Shouldn't she be threatening me with a lawsuit if I don't publicly retract what
I've been saying?!
Shouldn't Courtney Love, of all people, be telling me to "Go to hell!"?
On the other hand, if you were guilty, wouldn't it be smarter to use your charm,
your intellect, your well honed manipulative skills to try to turn this nosey
private investigator around, convince him of your innocence and see if you can
get him off your back?
Admitting she filed the missing person's report, not Kurt's mom, Wendy O'Connor, as stated on the police report and as reported in the media.
Admitting she burned the Rome note.
The "other note". . . "It's not really like a suicide note," Courtney says, and
claims she found it under her pillows on the bed. I challenge her, telling her we
looked under the pillows and there was no note. She sticks to her story. What else
could she do? She didn't know we had looked there until I told her.
You'll hear Courtney promise to show me this "other" note, but of course she never did.
While discussing the "Note from Rome" I asked, "Why would somebody tell you to get rid of that?"
"Because it wasn't really nice... It talked about getting a divorce," Courtney replied.
I'm acting angry at Courtney for not doing the things she promised to do several
months earlier, like getting Cali to my office for a Polygraph.
She's obviously rattled.
Once again, Courtney failed to follow through with any of her promises to cooperate.
I've had no personal contact with her since this last conversation.
May - 2012 Additional Audio Excerpts from telephone taped conversations
Before and After
Please remember, all mp3 files labeled "BEF" refer to conversations occurring before Kurt Cobain was found dead on April 8, 1994.
All mp3 files labeled "AFT" refer to conversations occurring after Kurt Cobain was found dead on April 8, 1994.
We've all been told that "Kurt had a HUGE drug problem." During the filming of "Kurt and Courtney", I began debating with Nick Broomfield as to whether or not Kurt would have been immediately incapacitated from the large dose of heroin just before he was shot. Nick responded to me, "But he also had a gigantic habit didn't her?"
Here, Courtney tells me, "I know bands with WAY bigger drug addicts in them..."
I also have a number of reasons to believe it was Courtney herself who talked Kurt into leaving the rehab in Marina Del Rey and fly back to their home in Seattle. This is where she could then have her plan "finalized" before he got away and told the world they had separated.
Here she tells me, "He shouldn't have to go to rehab to prove he's a good little boy"!
This conversation, along with the numerous telephone calls she made to the patients phone at the rehab center when Kurt was there, add some credence to my initial observations.
Courtney is upset because Kurt was not going to do the Lollapalooza gig in the summer of 1994.
She tells me that it was offered to her first (for less than $100,000) "but it would sell my record."
Then she adds, "I gave that up so that Kurt could go out and make 9 million, 10 million dollars"--(of which, as his wife, she would have access to all those millions).
This is a very early conversation I had with Rosemary Carroll (Courtney's entertainment attorney). It indicates my careful analysis of the situation at the time. I was not ready to state that I believed Kurt was murdered, but it is obvious we were both highly suspicious of the circumstances surrounding Kurt's death and of the alleged "suicide note".
Rosemary tells me she doesn't think Kurt wrote the so-called "suicide note" found at the scene. In saying this, the only logical conclusion then is that Rosemary believed Kurt was murdered--If Kurt didn't write that note, it had to be planted. There is no logical reason for someone else to plant a suicide note if Kurt had actually committed suicide.
I indicated to Rosemary that I believed we will discover that Kurt did write that note, (with the exception of the few suspicious looking lines at the end of the note), but that this was not a "suicide" note.
And, sure enough, I did later come to the conclusion that Kurt was not the person who left that note in the greenhouse, but that he did write the main body of the so-called "suicide note" at another time and place, and for a completely different purpose that had nothing to do with suicide.
(This excerpt had a lot of background line hum, so it had to be filtered for clarity).
Additional excerpts from January 19, 1995
Courtney is talking about Cali (Michael Dewitt), when I remind her that we can take care of all this by getting Cali in to take a polygraph examination.
Courtney is deliberately trying to confuse the issues by trying to convince me that the only place where there was blood at the scene of Kurt's death was by his feet. This is something I can easily prove to be false.
You'll notice how Courtney tends to veer off onto irrelevant issues, like telling me the names of all the people who were at the "intervention" when I never asked her for that information.
That's called "deflection", a method used often by Courtney to avoid talking about critical issues I need to discuss with her.
Listen carefully to how nervous Courtney gets when I challenge her assertion that Rosemary Carroll denies she said anything I claimed she said on the KROC radio interview.
This is just one more of Courtney's many lies that I've proven wrong with the release of these recorded conversations.
Courtney tells me where she says the "Diazepam" came from that was also in Kurt's blood system.
We then discuss the time and date of Kurt's death. I challenge her by stating clearly that anyone who claims to have seen Kurt after 7:30 AM Monday morning, April 4th, is lying.
I've also said in past years that if someone does claim to have seen Kurt after that time, I would challenge them to take a polygraph examination too.
Courtney talks about the drug dealer, "Kaitlin"--the lady who Courtney insisted we place under surveillance rather than watch the Lake Washington house.
She also tells me how she went over to Kaitlin's house, threw a brick through her kitchen window, then went around and bought drugs from her.
Courtney is telling me how she is going to try to kick drugs. In the mix of conversation, she also mentions her Rohypnol, adding... "the stuff I get from my English doctor."
You may recall, "Rohypnol" is the drug used on Kurt during the Rome incident.
I make Courtney aware that I don't trust anyone on the Seattle Homicide team right now.
She also confirms again that she got the note back from the Rome incident the day after Kristen Pfaff's death.
Recorded in 1990, just four years prior to her ride to fame after her "money ticket" strangely ended up dead from what appears to be a staged suicide, leaving Courtney Love to inherit the bulk of Kurt Cobain's ongoing wealth!
The Cobain Case Audio recordings end with Courtney Love singing Turpentine. Listen closely for the lyrics... "I'm gonna walk you to your suicide!"